A Second Opinion, The Oversharing Widower and a Guilty Mother
JUNE 3, 2009 TAGS:
Dear Judy,
My sister, who is just 29, has breast cancer in one breast, and her oncologist is recommending not just chemo, but also that her healthy breast be removed. He says the type of cancer she has is very aggressive, and she will more than likely die of breast cancer if she doesn't do as he says. (He says in fact that she might die anyway!)
We do not have a history of breast cancer in our family, and my sister is pretty young to be going through all these horrors. She has a kind of sweet temperament, very docile, and she says she's going to follow the Great Doctor's advice no matter what.
I say she should get a second opinion from another oncologist before undergoing a double mastectomy. She says a second opinion from another specialist would only hurt her doctor's feelings.
What do you think?
Karen
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Dear Karen,
Only second-rate doctors have their feelings hurt by second opinions. Especially when the issue is as important and critical as the one you describe.
Tell your sister that a few days spent consulting with other oncologists might be more important to her, her health and longevity than anything else she will ever do.
That should start her thinking straight. Right now she is in a state of crisis, and very confused. She is desperate for somebody -- anybody -- to save her, and that means she's willing to ascribe miraculous powers to the first doctor she consults. It's your job to keep her calm, rational, and thoughtful about her health choices, and to prod her into making good decisions.
A second opinion from another doctor will be a fine start in that direction.
Thank you for writing,
Judy
--
Dear Judy,
I'm told you deal with crazy people and crazy problems all the time, so maybe you can deal with this. It's my husband's father.
He's living with us temporarily (he's a widower; my mother-in-law died last year of lung cancer), and I guess he's lonely. So every night at the dinner table he talks-talks-talks.
It's not just that though. He talks about the details of his late wife's illness. I mean the graphic details. How she couldn't swallow towards the end, and what happened when things went wrong, what the pain meds did to her internal system (constipation); the blood, the smells. Our teenage kids have given up eating with us, they're grossed out. I am too.
We can't have guests over either, at least not when my father-in-law is at home. What can we do? Exile him to his room? Tell him to vacate the premises?
Evelyn
Dear Evelyn,
Yes, your father-in-law sounds lonely. And no, you and your family shouldn't have to be subjected to the graphic details of your late mother-in-law's illness.
Here's how to get around it without exiling the poor man to his room. The next time your father-in-law seems inclined to be chatty about stuff you don't want to hear at the dinner table, simply jump in boldly and say, "Oh I'd like to hear about that later, but at the moment I need to discuss ---"
And then change the topic. Quickly. Have a few subjects on tap just for such emergencies. If you do this often enough, your father-in-law might get the hint. If he doesn't, it's time for stronger measures. You can always tell him, if it comes to that, that the kids aren't ready for a graphic discussion of illness.
Thank you for writing,
Judy
--
Dear Judy,
When her boyfriend broke up with her, a young girl -- 17 -- committed suicide. She is (was) the daughter of a longtime friend. And to put it candidly, my friend was a so-so mother. Always criticizing the girl, never praising her, telling her she was "fat" or that her grades weren't up to par. Like that.
So I really think my friend's attitude contributed to that poor girl's suicide. My friend talks about it a lot, obviously, keeps pinning
the tragedy on the boy who broke off with her daughter. And keeps saying she was always "a good mother."
What should I say? If anything? Should I correct her? In my mind she was an awful mother, and maybe she should acknowledge that.
Lidia
Dear Lidia,
She should acknowledge – what? That the destruction of her daughter was entirely her fault? How will that help? More important, whom will that help?
And of equal interest: Why do you want her to acknowledge a guilt she already feels?
You should say nothing at all. Just hold your friend's hand and nod in sympathy.
Thank you for writing,
Judy
My sister, who is just 29, has breast cancer in one breast, and her oncologist is recommending not just chemo, but also that her healthy breast be removed. He says the type of cancer she has is very aggressive, and she will more than likely die of breast cancer if she doesn't do as he says. (He says in fact that she might die anyway!)
We do not have a history of breast cancer in our family, and my sister is pretty young to be going through all these horrors. She has a kind of sweet temperament, very docile, and she says she's going to follow the Great Doctor's advice no matter what.
I say she should get a second opinion from another oncologist before undergoing a double mastectomy. She says a second opinion from another specialist would only hurt her doctor's feelings.
What do you think?
Karen
Dear Karen,Only second-rate doctors have their feelings hurt by second opinions. Especially when the issue is as important and critical as the one you describe.
Tell your sister that a few days spent consulting with other oncologists might be more important to her, her health and longevity than anything else she will ever do.
That should start her thinking straight. Right now she is in a state of crisis, and very confused. She is desperate for somebody -- anybody -- to save her, and that means she's willing to ascribe miraculous powers to the first doctor she consults. It's your job to keep her calm, rational, and thoughtful about her health choices, and to prod her into making good decisions.
A second opinion from another doctor will be a fine start in that direction.
Thank you for writing,
Judy
--
Dear Judy,
I'm told you deal with crazy people and crazy problems all the time, so maybe you can deal with this. It's my husband's father.
He's living with us temporarily (he's a widower; my mother-in-law died last year of lung cancer), and I guess he's lonely. So every night at the dinner table he talks-talks-talks.
It's not just that though. He talks about the details of his late wife's illness. I mean the graphic details. How she couldn't swallow towards the end, and what happened when things went wrong, what the pain meds did to her internal system (constipation); the blood, the smells. Our teenage kids have given up eating with us, they're grossed out. I am too.
We can't have guests over either, at least not when my father-in-law is at home. What can we do? Exile him to his room? Tell him to vacate the premises?
Evelyn
Dear Evelyn,
Yes, your father-in-law sounds lonely. And no, you and your family shouldn't have to be subjected to the graphic details of your late mother-in-law's illness.
Here's how to get around it without exiling the poor man to his room. The next time your father-in-law seems inclined to be chatty about stuff you don't want to hear at the dinner table, simply jump in boldly and say, "Oh I'd like to hear about that later, but at the moment I need to discuss ---"
And then change the topic. Quickly. Have a few subjects on tap just for such emergencies. If you do this often enough, your father-in-law might get the hint. If he doesn't, it's time for stronger measures. You can always tell him, if it comes to that, that the kids aren't ready for a graphic discussion of illness.
Thank you for writing,
Judy
--
Dear Judy,
When her boyfriend broke up with her, a young girl -- 17 -- committed suicide. She is (was) the daughter of a longtime friend. And to put it candidly, my friend was a so-so mother. Always criticizing the girl, never praising her, telling her she was "fat" or that her grades weren't up to par. Like that.
So I really think my friend's attitude contributed to that poor girl's suicide. My friend talks about it a lot, obviously, keeps pinning
the tragedy on the boy who broke off with her daughter. And keeps saying she was always "a good mother."
What should I say? If anything? Should I correct her? In my mind she was an awful mother, and maybe she should acknowledge that.
Lidia
Dear Lidia,
She should acknowledge – what? That the destruction of her daughter was entirely her fault? How will that help? More important, whom will that help?
And of equal interest: Why do you want her to acknowledge a guilt she already feels?
You should say nothing at all. Just hold your friend's hand and nod in sympathy.
Thank you for writing,
Judy
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COMMENTS (2)
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Melissa Tidwell wrote on June 3, 2009 8:59am
I second Charlene's insight that this grieving man needs someone to talk to. Someone (it really ought to be the son if but the writer may have to step in if her husband won't) someone, needs to make some time to listen, to say: "look, I'll have coffee with you every Saturday at 10am and you can tell me everything you need to, and we will do this every week until you feel ready to stop; if you will commit to being more sensitive to the kids about the dinner time conversation." The Dad might reply that he wouldn't be comfortable doing that (he may not realize how much he talks about it now) and if so, that would be a good time to offer him a list of support groups or therapists nearby. Giving another human being that gift of attention is one of the most important and gracious things any of us can do with our time, and it would be the right kind of example to set for the kids rather than fleeing and avoiding the pain that is right under their noses. [Report Comment]
Charlene Vickers wrote on June 3, 2009 8:41am
Judy, in my opinion your advice to the second writer is incorrect. The father is feeling immense guilt right now, and I suspect that his constant reiteration of her symptoms and her treatments is a desperate attempt to convince himself that he wasn't at fault for her death. He's really telling himself and his family, "look how sick she was: look at how horribly she suffered; you can't blame me for her death!" Why he's feeling this guilt is another question: did he have to make the decision to discontinue treatment, or did he not disagree when she chose to discontinue it? Did he push her to undergo treatments that caused her suffering but which didn't help? Given that she died of cancer, did he smoke, or did he "fail" to prevent her from smoking? Did she put off going to the doctor, and did he not nag her about it? He needs help, not subtle hints and diverting. He needs to be told outright by his family that they don't blame him, and that he shouldn't blame himself. But at the same time he should not be simply diverted from talking about it. They have to be open with him and tell him, calmly and patiently but firmly, that he must not discuss these things at the dinner table. Part of the reason he's doing it is latent and possibly subconscious hostility - he *wants* to hurt them because he's lost his wife, he's in pain, and they aren't as upset and as grieved as he is (and how can they be?). He wants them to feel the same pain he does. Diverting him and changing the subject just tells him that they don't care about his pain, that his pain is an inconvenience to him. He really needs a place to vent and a place to examine his feelings. He really needs counselling. But tee-hee hints and subtle diversions will not change him, just make him even more bitter than he is. [Report Comment]
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STAYING AT HOME, A GOOD DEATH AND EXCESSIVE DONATIONS
MY HUSBAND'S GIRLFRIEND, A SHOUTING BOSS AND READY-FOR-THE-GRAVE
ASKING THE QUESTION, CHANGING CARE AND PERFECT SILENCE
MASS EMAILS, NO SYMPATHY CARDS AND DEATHBED APOLOGIES
INCURABLE SECRETS, AN UGLY COUSIN AND A SMELLY EX
ENSURING YOUR ESTATE FALLS IN THE RIGHT HANDS
BAD MOUTHING THE DEAD, EMBALMING AND GUILT
THE RAGE OF THE DYING, FUNERAL GLOATING AND ALZHEIMER'S DESTRUCTION
BURIAL AT SEA, PHANTOM SYMPTOMS AND A DISTANT FATHER
FEELING LIKE A BRAT, ENSURING INHERITANCE AND FUNERAL TRUSTS
SHOULD A FIVE YEAR-OLD SEE AN EMBALMED BODY? AND MORE...
A TRAVELING BODY, FEASTING AT A FUNERAL AND BUSTING EUPHEMISMS
WHEN NOTHING CAN BE RECONCILED
PANNA COTTA, STAYING OUT OF THE ICU AND AVOIDING A SKUNK
THE SIMPLE THINGS, AN ESTRANGED MOTHER AND A BOSSY BROTHER
OFFENSIVE CHILDREN, EXPENSIVE COFFINS AND RUDE WAKE GUESTS
CRUELTY, FEAR AND ANGER AT THE END
CORPSE REAL ESTATE, SECRET FAMILIES AND DIVIDING A BEQUEST
LYING TO THE DYING, PRE-PLANNING AND AN UNLOVED COUSIN
THE OTHER FAMILY, APATHY AND CYBER SNOOPING
SURVIVORS, COST OVERRUNS AND REINCARNATION
AN AWFUL PATIENT, RESTORING BEAUTY AND THANK YOU NOTES
A STEPFATHER'S NEGLECT, A CHRISTIAN BURIAL AND A DYING TWIN
A DISTANT BOYFRIEND, PRE-NEED QUESTIONS AND HUSBAND IN A COMA
A MISTRESS CALLS, A FRIEND'S MOTHER AND BEING THERE
THE LIMITS OF CARE, SUMMER CHOICES AND CHURCH GIVING
WHEN TO STAY AT HOME, WHEN TO VISIT
AN OLDER FIANCE, TO SUE OR NOT TO SUE AND DISAPPEARING MALICE
MYTHIC PLANS, OFFICE COLLECTIONS AND BEING POLITE
CHILDHOOD GRIEF, A TWIN'S DEATH AND A STEP-DAUGHTER GRIPES
CELEBRATING LIFE AND NEARING THE END
AN OLD SCHOOL MAMA, A CHEATING HUSBAND AND A MOUTHY NEIGHBOR
SOCIAL REJECTION, A CHATTY DOORMAN AND POLITICAL DISPUTES
FINDING SUPPORT, A JEALOUS WIFE AND A BORING WAKE
AN AILING MOTHER OVERSEAS AND A SCHEMING BROTHER
AN ACCIDENTAL SUICIDE, A NEW WIFE AND THE LONG HAUL
A BIOLOGICAL FATHER, HEAVEN, HELL AND UNSOCIABLE STEPMOTHER
POWER OF ATTORNEY, A LIVING WILL AND A BAD-MOUTHING MOTHER
EXTREME DRIVING, TALKING TO A DEAD HUSBAND AND FEARING A SON
A LOYAL/MALICIOUS AUNT, VISITING A VICIOUS SISTER AND A LOVER'S FUNERAL
A FATHER IN JAIL, A CLASSMATE'S FUNERAL AND A PASTOR'S LAMENT
HIDDEN RAGE, A DISAPPEARING HUSBAND AND A CONDO IN PHOENIX
THE MISDIAGNOSIS, QUITTING SMOKING AND SMOKING AT THE END
MY DAD'S LAST NAME, A RUSSIAN LAST NAME AND A ROTTEN FRIEND
A WEEPY CLASSMATE, FROM BEDSIDE TO HONG KONG AND A VICIOUS MOTHER
HOW DO I TELL MY TEENAGE DAUGHTER THAT HER FATHER IS DYING OF CANCER?
A SMOKER, A PAIR OF EARRINGS AND THE AFTERLIFE
WHAT DOES DEATH LOOK LIKE, A SURVIVOR'S BOASTS AND VISITING A DYING BROTHER
HEAVY GYM TALK, DRUGS THAT HASTEN DEATH AND A MISTRESS REVEALED
A DEAD PRINCIPAL, A HOSPICE NURSE AT BOOK CLUB AND A GOOD FRIEND
A DISRESPECTED ONCOLOGIST, A GRIEVING HOUSEKEEPER AND IMPROPER CONDOLENCES
AN ESTRANGED UNCLE, A SCHIZOPHRENIC MOM AND PROBLEMS WITH A JUG
THE HALO EFFECT AND FORGETTING A DEATH
A DRESS TO DIE FOR, A BRAGGART GRIEVES AND AN ANNIVERSARY PARTY
NO THANK YOU NOTE, HIRING PEOPLE WITH CANCER AND HONORING A STEPFATHER
A FIRST CLASS BODY, THE DEATH RATTLE AND HELPING A FAMILY FRIEND
A NEEDY SISTER, FURIOUS STEP-CHILDREN AND WHY WE TALK ABOUT DEATH
A STEPMOTHER'S ODD REQUESTS, PAYING BACK A LOAN AND HALLUCINATIONS AT THE END
PRETENDING HIS WIFE IS DEAD, A LAST WILL AND WHAT TO SAY
DYING IN THE SADDLE, CREMATION PROBLEMS AND A MOTHER'S MENTAL ILLNESS
MY LATE BOYFRIEND'S PARENTS, PROBLEMS WITH A WILL AND HOW TO LISTEN
THOUSANDS OF MILES FROM A LOVED ONE, AN ABSENT COUSIN AND MAKING PLANS
REFUSING TO MAKE END-OF-LIFE-DECISIONS AND PLANNING A SENSIBLE FUNERAL
GRIEVING FOR A POODLE, SHOPPING FOR HOSPICE AND HAVING TROUBLE WITH A SPIRITUAL COUNSELOR
A CHILD MOLESTER, A DYING FRIEND AND MISSTEPS IN FRONT OF A WIDOW
A POLITICIAN'S DEMISE, A WIDOW'S FINANCES AND ADVICE FOR A SIMPLE FUNERAL
THE METAPHYSICS OF ASH SCATTERING, A LIVING WILL AND A SILENT FRIEND
A DEADBEAT BROTHER, SPURNED IN-LAWS, AND THE ANNOYANCE OF CONSTANT COMPANY
A TYRANNICAL WIDOWER, EMAIL DEATH NOTIFICATION AND AN ILLEGITIMATE CHILD RETURNS
DO I HAVE TO PAY FOR MY PARENTS' FUNERALS?
OFFICE GIFT GIVING GOES AWRY, OVERSEAS EXPENSES AND A CAR CRASH
TOO MANY VISITORS, ADVICE FOR A HOSPICE WORKER AND A CHILD'S ROOM
A HAPPY WIDOW, QUICK DEATHS AND A LINGERING VOICEMAIL MESSAGE
A SON'S PARTNER IN THE FAMILY VAULT, REPRESSED MEMORIES OF ABUSE AND HELL
THE PLEASURES OF CHEESECAKE, A VACATION FROM DEATH AND DYING AT HOME
A NANNY'S LAMENT, A PEDESTRIAN'S DEATH AND A MOTORCYCLE
GIVING UP, THE NEEDY WIDOW AND A FORGOTTEN LEGACY
THE MAN WHO BROKE MY HEART, A CHURCH SCANDAL AND A CALLOUS COUSIN
MY CRAZY SISTER, A WHACKO CHARITY AND WHETHER TO BRING A CHILD TO A FUNERAL
A MURDERED MOM, QUICK WILLS AND RECOVERING FROM HOSPICE
A FRIEND SUFFERS ALONE, CREMATION AND JUDAISM, AND A LONELY CARETAKER
JUDGING LUNG CANCER, GLOATING AT A FUNERAL AND BUYING AN URN
DEBUNKING FUNERAL MYTHS, FALLING IN LOVE WITH YOUR EX, AND A BOOZER FIANCE
ENDING YOUR LIFE, LATE CONDOLENCES, AND CALLOUS CO-WORKERS
A FATHER'S NEW GIRLFRIEND, A DEMANDING WIFE AND REFUSING CANCER TREATMENT
LIVING WILL TROUBLE, A HUSBAND DIES IN JAIL AND A NEW WAY TO BEQUEATH
IN LOVE WITH A WIDOWER, TERMINAL DEPRESSION AND BUCKING DEPENDENCY
GUILT FOR PAST DEEDS, A SICK TEACHER AND RECOVERING A PAIR OF EARRINGS
DEALING WITH DENIAL, A MOTHER'S MALICE AND A WAYWARD WIDOWER
HIDING THE D-WORD, WHEN TO TELL THE KIDS AND HOW TO AVOID SPEAKING AT A FUNERAL
FORMER LOVERS, PRAYERS LEFT UNSAID AND MOVING TO NEW HOUSE
AT A LOSS FOR WORDS, SIBLING DISCORD AND HAVING A BABY
A MANGY DOG, THE DEATH OF A LITTLE SISTER AND DONATING A MOTHER'S STUFF
A PUSHY PRIEST, SUSPICIOUS DENTAL WORK AND GETTING A FRIEND'S GROOVE BACK
AN ENEMY AT WORK FALLS ILL, THE BIG NOTHING AND DENYING THE INEVITABLE
A MISTRESS'S GRIEF, DEMENTIA'S TOLL AND GOSSIP AT THE DEATHBED
DIFFERING VALUES, PRIVATE GOODBYES AND RECURRENT MEMORIES OF 9/11
TROUBLE WITH AN OUT-OF-TOWN RELATIVE, INVASIVE QUESTIONS AND EXPENSIVE SUPPORT
STEP-FATHERS, ABUSIVE EX'S AND DO NOT RESUSCITATE ORDERS
MOTHERS-IN-LAW, UNEXPECTED CHANGES AND HEALTH ANXIETY
DESERVED AFFECTION, THE FAMILY ACCOUNTANT AND ICE CREAM
OUT-OF-TOWN BURIAL, CONDOLENCE NOTES AND EARLY ONSET ALZHEIMER'S
HOW LONG TO STAY, A USED CAR AND A DYING EX-HUSBAND
PAYING THE MORTGAGE AND GRAND THEFT JEWELRY
SYMPATHY CARDS, ASSISTING SUICIDE AND INAPPROPRIATE FUNERAL WEAR
ENERGY, GRIEVING AND MEMORY, JUDY'S THIRD COLUMN
EATING, ANGER AND ATHEISTS, ASK JUDY'S SECOND COLUMN
BIRTHDAYS, GUILT AND SUICIDE, ASK JUDY'S FIRST COLUMN
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